BENCH TESTING OF THE TURNIGY D2826/6 2200 KV MOTOR

Hi everyone -

Just finished up another round of bench testing on another popular motor that is on the RC Powers Master Parts list, the Turnigy D2826/6 2200 Kv motorhttp://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=12919&aff=46898

I have used this motor on several different light weight parkjets and it works very well. I tested it on three different props when testing my lightweight F18, but never played around much with the settings on my ESC to see what sort of thrust and efficiency numbers were being produced. Once again I found that this is another motor that seems to like the 6x3 EMP prop from a standpoint of thrust and efficiency. I have only ever used a 6x4 APC prop on this plane, but will now be switching to a 6x3 EMP. 

I tested on a Turnigy Plush 40A ESC as HK suggests this motor has a max current of 34A. I think from the numbers I got and also confirmation from Airflow on the RC Powers forums that I will be safe using a 30A ESC from now on to save myself a little bit of weight.

The battery I used was a 3S 30-40C discharge

Here are the numbers -

6x4 APC prop at 50% throttle -

• ESC at low timing - 14.4 A/168W/500 gr/17.6 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium timing - 13.2A/153.1W/450 gr/15.9 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high timing - 13.8 A/164.7W/480 gr/16.9 oz of thrust

6x4 APC at 100% throttle -

• ESC at low timing - 26A/280.9 W/720 gr/25.4 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium timing - 29A/335 W/750 gr/26.5 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high timing - 27A/299.7 W/745 gr/26.3 oz of thrust.

6x3 EMP at 50% throttle -

• ESC at low timing - 13.1A/156.3W/550 gr/19.4 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium timing - 12.7A/148.8W/535 gr/18.9 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high timing - 15.2A/182.7W/570 gr/20.1 oz of thrust.

6x3 EMP at 100% throttle -

• ESC at low timing - 26.8A/317.4W/870 gr/30.7 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium timing - 23.6A/261.7W/860 gr/30.3 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high timing - 23.7A/262.4W/860 gr/30.3 oz of thrust.

6x4 EMP at 50% throttle -

• ESC at low timing - 13.6A/159.2W/550 gr/19.4 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium timing - 13.7A/159.5W/560 gr/19.8 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high timing - 14.7A/177W/560 gr/19.8 oz of thrust.

6x4 EMP at 100% throttle -

• ESC at low timing - 25.5A/298.4W/835 gr/29.5 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium timing - 26.3A/305.9W/860 gr/30.3 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high timing - 25.5A/287.5 W/840 gr/29.6 oz.

This is another small motor that seems to really like the 6x3 EMP prop from a standpoint of thrust and efficiency.  The thrust numbers are slightly lower at medium timing setting, but overall efficiency especially at high throttle are much better than at low setting, so I think I would run this motor on a 6x3 EMP prop and a 30A ESC and it would be a great power combo.

I also did a walkaround video yesterday on my newest Mig29 V3 to discuss my build techniques, etc.  Here it is.

For my next build I am considering another FRC Foamies F35 600, I just love that little plane, I am going to build it as light as possible and probably try out the RC Timer 2212-6 2200 Kv motor in it on a 30A ESC and 1600 Mah battery, I think that would be a good power setup.  I will again activate all control surfaces, but I think I will do something a little different with my vertical stab and rudder setup over the previous two I built with full controls.  Paint job will probably be in Vancouver Canucks colors since hockey season starts this week!  WOO HOO!  GO CANUCKS GO!

Cheers,

Scott

RC POWERS MIG 29 V3 BUILD COMPLETE

Hi everyone -

Just finished my second Mig 29 V3 build, this time built with a smaller and lighter power setup than my "speed Mig" and with all control surfaces activated.

My paint job was inspired by a scheme I found at this website, it is an excellent source of info if you are looking for inspiration for a Mig 29 paint jobhttp://www.mars.slupsk.pl/fort/mig/

As some of you probably know, when Germany re-unified, the Luftwaffe absorbed Mig 29s from the East German Air Force, and I had been looking for a good paint scheme to inspire me and found this one. I am not talented enough a painter to copy it exactly and I left the grey nose off, but hopefully I have honored the German flag with the color representation. I also think it should be pretty easy to see in the sky! I didn't fully paint the bottom to save a little weight and to help with contrast and orientation.

My AUW with an 1800 Mah battery is 520 gr/18.3 oz which I am pretty happy about, I think it will be pretty quick and maneuverable and my goal was to get in under 19 oz.

My build details -

• 6mm depron glued with Foam Tac and a few dabs of hot glue and epoxy here and there;
• 4mm Kf 4 airfoils top and bottom made with dollar store foam with paper removed;
• all leading edges bevelled and sanded for looks and to help reduce aerodynamic drag;
• paint is dollar store acrylic craft paint (total weight added of paint and decals 17 gr/0.6 oz);
• 6 servos, 2 x 9 gr plastic gear servos for the elevons, 2 x 9 gr plastic gear servos for the ailerons, 2 x 5 gr plastic gear servos for the rudders;
• Rx is a 6 channel receiver compatible with my Turnigy er9x, rudders are connected via a Y harness into rudder channel;
• control surfaces are elevons, ailerons mixed as spoilerons (switch selectable) and rudders;
• push rods are scratchbuilt 2mm carbon fibre tube, clevis from Hobby King and linkage stoppers from Hobby King; and
• power system is a Focal Price 2700 Kv motor, 30 Turnigy Plush ESC and 1800 Mah battery 3S, 30-40 C discharge, based on the testing I did yesterday, I should get close to 36 oz of thrust with this setup at full throttle using a balanced 6x3 EMP prop.

My first Mig I ended up with the CofG about 2 and 7/8" behind the wing break where it meets the leading edge extension. I will start off just a little ahead of that for the maiden and then balance out as I get it dialed in.

Weather unfortunately is not supposed to be too great the next few days, so it will be a while before I get to take it up and rip around the field, but I'm excited to see it's full aerobatic potential!

Cheers,

Scott

RCP MIG 29 V3 BUILD DAY 3 AND MORE MOTOR TESTING

I finished sanding my Mig 29 today, dry fitted all the servos and made my carbon fibre pushrods.  The paint job is about half done now, just need to put the black on and then do the final touch ups.

I put another motor through it's paces on the bench today, the RC Timer 2212-6 2200 Kv motor http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=116&productname=

I tested at low, medium and high timing settings on my Turnigy Plush 30A ESC for three different props 6x4 APC, 6x3 EMP, 6x4 EMP. The motor is brand new out of the package, the one I was testing on my F18 had a couple bad bearings in it, so I used a new one which ran much smoother.
Here are the findings for the 6x4 APC prop at 50% throttle -

• ESC at low setting - 11.45A/134.4W/442 gr/15.6 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium setting - 12A/140.5W/444 gr/15.66 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high setting - 12A/140W/434 gr/15.3 oz

6x4 APC prop at 100% throttle -

• ESC at low setting - 22.78A/263.4W/654 gr/23.07 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium setting - 22.62A/251.8W/614 gr/21.7 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high setting - 26.27A/307.6W/669 gr/23.6 oz of thrust

6x3 EMP prop at 50% throttle -

• ESC at low setting - 12.9A/157W/470 gr/16.6 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium setting - 11.9A/142.7W/542 gr/19.1 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high setting - 13.9A/170.5W/528 gr/18.6 oz of thrust

6x3 EMP prop at 100% throttle -

• ESC at low setting - 20.9A/253W/670 gr/23.6 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium setting - 23.5A/282.9W/825 gr/29 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high setting - 22.7A/261.7W/790 gr/27.9 oz of thrust

6x4 EMP prop at 50% throttle -

• ESC at low setting - 12.3A/152.8W/500 gr/17.6 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium setting - 12.8A/153.3W/485 gr/17.1 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high setting - 12.17A/143.4W/490 gr/17.3 oz of thrust

6x4 EMP prop at 100% throttle -

• ESC at low setting - 21.25A/245.9W/765 gr/27 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium setting - 21.7A/249.2W/765 gr/27 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high setting - 26.2A/307.2W/805 gr/28.4 gr of thrust.

I think it is pretty obvious that this is a motor that prefers EMP props over APC from a standpoint of efficiency and power. I looked back at my writeup when I did the field testing on this motor on my F18 and although I at first felt I was getting better performance from the 6x4 EMP, I changed my mind after the fact and felt the 6x3 EMP was a better choice. And that was running all three props on low timing. 

I find it an interesting discovery in the relationship between the different props and the timing setting on the ESC.

The two 6x4 props seem to be most efficient (ie best thrust for the amp draw) at low setting on this motor, where the 6x3 EMP prop definitely performed the best of all the props on a medium setting. I am pleasantly surprised at those numbers for such an affordable motor for sure! To have 19 oz of thrust at half throttle at just over 11 amps and 29 oz of thrust at full throttle for 23.5 amps is pretty darn good performance in my book!

If you read the first review written on this motor, a person claimed to get 28 oz of thrust on a 6x4 APC and 32 oz of thrust on a 6x3 EMP. I didn't get those numbers, but I definitely got the better performance all round with the 6x3 EMP prop on medium timing on my setup anyway.

I forgot to add that I used a freshly charged battery each time, 3S 30-40C discharge.

So as I may have mentioned in my field review this motor is a definite step up in performance over the MJV3 if you are looking for a little extra punch. It is 11 gr heavier, and best to be paired with an EMP prop, 6x3 preferably. I know it has been mentioned numerous times, but it is very important to balance the EMP props, they are notoriously out of balance out of the package, but a little time balancing it gives great performance!

Anyway, interesting information to use to get the maximum performance out of this motor...for me anyway, hope it is of help to you!

Cheers,

Scott

RC POWERS MIG 29 V3 BUILD DAY 2

I managed to get considerable work done on my Mig29 yesterday.  It is all assembled except the electronics bay hatch is not yet secured, will do that today before sanding.  I got the whole plane glued together, motor mount and control horns are now installed, Kf airfoils are on and bevelling of all leading edges has been completed.

I decided after some bench testing of different motors at different ESC settings to go with the Focal Price 2700 Kv motor on this plane.  I was blown away by the thrust numbers I got on low setting on my ESC and will save 22 grams/0.78 oz of weight by using the lighter motor.  Here are the numbers I got from this motor on a 6x3 EMP prop -

Here are the numbers I got at 50% throttle for each of the timing settings -

• ESC at low timing - 15.27A/184W/538 gr/19 oz of thrust;
• ESC at medium timing - 12.7A/153W/478 gr/16.86 oz of thrust; and
• ESC at high timing - 15.46A/179.4W/470 gr/16.58 oz of thrust.

Here are the numbers I got for 100% throttle setting for each of the timing settings -

• ESC at low timing - 30.5A/327W/1014 gr/35.77 oz;
• ESC at medium timing - 33.4A/368W/1028 gr/36.26 oz; and
• ESC at high timing - 34.05A/365W/1030 gr/36.33 oz.

Since I am planning on doing a heavier paint scheme on this plane than my last one, I am trying to save weight wherever I can, this will be the inspiration for my paint scheme

Based on what I saw from the weight gain on the F22 paint job, I estimate this paint job will add about 20 gr/0.7 oz.  I won't paint the bottom to save a bit of weight and to help give more distinct contrast.  I'm also not going to bother with the gray nose and tips on the vertical stabilizers.  I'm hoping it will look very cool when it is done!

I'm also going to experiment with using 5gram nylon gear servos on my ailerons.  I am thinking that as long as my elevons have good 9gr servos, that will be my last point of failure where I will still be able to control the plane, so if the 5 gr servos on the ailerons/rudders go, I still can fly and control the plane to recover it.

I'm hoping to get the sanding completed today and the servos and control rods sorted out and perhaps start on the paint job today.

Cheers,

Scott

RC POWERS MIG 29 V3 BUILD DAY 1

Made considerable progress on my 2nd Mig 29 V3, this one will have all controls activated and a lighter power setup than my Speed Mig.  I will be trying to build as light as possible.

Today I finished cutting out all the foam, it weighs 134 gr/4.7 oz without the Kf4 airfoils.  I already expanded the back of the prop slot and cut some cooling vents in the side of the fuselage to increase airflow through the electronics compartment.

I'm thinking I will go with the Power Up Zoom 450 motor with a 6x4 APC prop and 2200 battery, but I will try a 30A ESC instead of 40A to see if I can't save a little more weight.  Now that the weather is getting cooler and with the large vents, I'm hoping cooling won't be too much of a problem, in testing on my F18 I was pulling 28.5 watts and the Turnigy Plush 30A ESC is capable of handling bursts of 40A.

I installed all the carbon reinforcements in the wing (4mm carbon rod), elevons and back deck plate (3mm carbon tube) which added 20 grams/0.71 oz, but it is very worthwhile weight in my opinion.

All control surfaces are bevelled and glued, I will also be reinforcing the elevons hinges with tape as the Foam Tac does not last too long, but it helps the two pieces be nice and snug together when I apply the tape.

Tomorrow I hope to get pretty much the rest of the build complete, control horns installed, wing and fuse attached, back plate attached, etc and nose formed.  Should be a fairly quick build.  Paint job might take a little bit of time, but I think it will be worth it.

Cheers,

Scott

RC POWERS F18 V3 AND GRAYSON HOBBY SMJV2

Hi everyone -

Just back from testing my last motor and prop combo on my lightweight F18 V3. This time I was testing the Grayson Hobby SMJV2 motor and for the first time decided to give it a try with the 6x3 and 6x4 EMP props, just for giggles and grins!

I probably win the "bonehead of the year" award for running my plane into my leg on the first test flight on landing!  I think I have most of it on video, tried to get too cute on landing, caught a bit of a cross wind and next thing I know I'm fixing my plane with hot glue and tape! Good news is other than adding a little bit of weight and character, it still flies great!

A couple pictures of the post flight repairs before the addition of some tape, thank goodness for some hot glue sticks, Bic lighter and some fibreglass strapping tape, she is almost good as new!

I was running a Turnigy Plush 40A ESC with this motor and had the timing set on medium, not for any test purposes, but mostly because I was too lazy to change it after the last two motors I tested. I have to say I was impressed by how the SMJV2 handled that timing setup, I think it performed the best I have seen it perform in a long time, so I will keep that timing set on my ESC.

The numbers from the wattmeter for the three props are as follows -

6x4 APC - 32A/384W;
6x3 EMP - 29A/354W; and
6x4 EMP - 28A/313W

The 6x4 EMP was definitely a very inefficient setup for this motor, speed was down over both the other props as was punch out power and vertical. The 6x3 EMP gave decent results, probably more efficient than the 6x4 APC for sure and decent acceleration and punch out, but not the top end speed that the 6x4 APC provided.

The weight of the plane (before repairs...) with a 2200 Mah battery is 603 gr/21.27 oz, so only 4 grams heavier than the setup with the Zoom 450 motor.
With the way I fly on a 2200 Mah battery I would get about a 5:30 minute flight with the 6x4 APC prop and about 6:00-6:30 on the 6x3 EMP prop. I wouldn't even bother with the 6x4 EMP unless it was the last prop I had in my flight box and I wanted to get a few more flights in, it is not an efficient prop for this motor, the motor ran the warmest of the three props with significantly reduced performance.


The 6x4 APC prop on this motor at this weight gave me the best speed and acceleration of all the motor/prop combos I have tested thus far on this plane, just slightly ahead of the Zoom 450 with the same prop, but the Zoom 450 runs about 10% more efficiently than the SMJV2 with this prop, so it would be down to personal preference.


I like this weight for this plane, it handles the wind the best of all the weight setups I have tested. It carries it's momentum really well and still does amazing aerobatics with no adverse affects to the handling.

So based on info that F1wanabe  from the RC Powers forum passed along that 23 oz is kind of the threshold beyond which maneuverability starts to fall off, I could still build another one very light, go with the heavier setup and add in a really cool paint job and still be under 23 oz!:)

I also found out the breaking point of the Foam Tac hinges on this plane, I think I was at about the 80 flight point, the Foam Tac on the left elevon has now completely let go, so fortunately I had already reinforced it with tape.  I will now reinforce every elevon hinge I make with tape just to ensure I have the strength and back up I need without adding a whole lot of weight.

The video will still be a while processing, so I will post that when it is ready!

Cheers,

Scott

Here is the video as promised.

RC POWERS F22 V3 SEAHAWKS JET MAIDEN COMPLETE

Hi everyone -

Just back from the field after blasting through some lipos on my 3rd F22 V3, the Seahawks Jet! Was getting a little too windy for my liking, so I thought best to call it a day until I have the plane completely dialed in before trying it in higher winds.

Wow, what a difference 2 oz/58 grams of weight makes on this plane! I just finished watching Dave Powers' and Scott Lott's promo video at the start of this thread one more time to remind myself of the characteristics Dave described in the video as I wasn't sure at the heavier weight of 26.5 oz/750 grams that I was experiencing all of those characteristics. Well, the reduced weight does amazing things for this plane from a standpoint of acceleration, top speed and crispness and handling in aerobatics.

In the video, Dave refers to this plane as a "sports/muscle car" and I know I have used the same term myself, but at this lighter weight it is even more true. It is not a plane at this weight that you can or really want to just put on cruise control and do lazy circles around the field. It will do that, for sure, but I cannot let my mind wander when flying this plane at this weight and with this power setup or it will bite back!

I found the controls much more responsive, so in order to avoid "over control", I put the expo up about 10% over where it was before on my heavier planes and it smoothed out my "twitchiness". I'm sure I will be able to bring this down somewhat as I get more flights in.

The aerobatics now are unbelievable, I had only about 75% throws on today for the maiden and I went into a couple of high speed full deflection loops and was amazed at how it just carved a perfect circle so smooth and so quick that the loop was done before I realized I had done it!

At the lighter weight, it slows down quite a bit quicker without that extra bit of weight and momentum, so I had to be more careful on the throttle in turns and slow rolls or the nose or tail would drop quicker than what I was used to. Same thing when just cruising along straight and level, once the airflow over those vertical stabilizers gets down to a certain point as Dave says in the video, the tail will drop on you. But if you have good power and punch out for the weight of plane you build, it is recoverable...:)

As Dave says in the video, this plane does like speed! At this lighter weight, anywhere above 50% throttle and it is like driving a sports car, tons of responsiveness to the throttle and all control surfaces, just an absolute blast to fly, it transitioned from one aggressive maneuver to the next without hesitation and without bad habits (as long as I didn't let too much speed bleed off). It will cruise around comfortably "in town" at 50% throttle as long as you watch how tight you make your turns, but once you open it up on the "open highway", hang on!

I did manage to get a certain amount of dialing in done today, I have the CofG in the pitch sorted out for zero trim and my CofG is 3 and 1/2" inches behind the wing break, so even further back than the second one I built by about 3/8". I'm not sure where that relates to the stock CofG on the current plans, I would suggest starting with what is on the plans for now and work it whatever way you need to to get it sorted out to the way you like to fly. I'm still working on getting trim in the roll down to zero by gradually moving my battery with relation to centreline. My last F22 it took me about a dozen flights to get it sorted, but it is worth the time and patience, cause one it is dialed in, the fun really begins!

The lighter weight also meant keeping on a little more power when landing, when keeping the same throttle settings as with my heavier versions, it would slow down too fast and I would get the nose popping up, tail sinking or even a bit of tip stall.

So at this weight and configuration, I definitely see the nickname "the Expert's Parkjet" more clearly. I am definitely not an expert, perhaps somewhere between novice and intermediate, but I find this plane a real joy to fly. Like a sports car, if you respect it and treat it right, it will respond in amazing ways with amazing accleration and handling. But if you get complacent or lose focus, it can bite you hard and fast! It likes a little extra speed when in doubt, especially in the turns and on approach to landing, but I far prefer this weight to the heavier versions I built. Again, I wouldn't have thought 2 oz would make that much difference, but it does.

If you are really ready for a new challenge, this plane in this configuration is a great option, I look forward to having a lot more fun with it and getting it truly dialed in. 

Here is some flight video I shot today

Cheers,

Scott

3RD F22 V3 BUILD COMPLETE

Hi everyone -

Just finished up my 3rd F22 V3 build today. Since the NFL season has started I decided to go with a Seattle Seahawks inspired paint job since they are my favorite team and the Seahawk (Osprey) is a raptor, so that works out...:) .

I used many of the techniques I used in my lightweight F18 build and ended up with a weight 58 gr/2 oz lighter than my previous two builds, so my total weight with 2200 battery is 692 gr/24.4 oz. This reduces my wing loading quite significantly, my wing loading now will be 6.77 oz/sq ft versus 7.35 oz/sq ft on my previous builds. So I should be a little quicker top speed and hopefully even a little bit more nimble in the handling and aerobatics.

My build -

• 6 mm depron using Foam Tac glue with a little bit of hot glue or epoxy here and there;
• Kf4 airfoils made with 4 mm dollar store foam top and bottom;
• all control surfaces active as elevons, ailerons (mixed as spoilerons switch selectable) and rudders. To save weight, I went with a 6 ch receiver and used a Y harness for my rudder servos, saved me about 14 grams just in Rx weight alone;
• servos are 9 gr (which actually weight 14 gr) metal gear servos on the elevons, 9 gr (which actually weigh 10 gr) nylon gear servos for the ailerons and 5 gr nylon gear servos for the rudders;
• control rods are scratchbuilt 2mm carbon fibre rod with HK nylon clevis and quick connects on the opposite end from the clevis;
• motor is NTM Prop Drive 2700 Kv, 6x4 APC prop, Turnigy Plush 60A ESC and battery Nanotech 2200 Mah 3S, 45-90 C discharge, motor wattmeter numbers 58A/633W;
• all leading edges bevelled and sanded, no filler this time;
• paint is acrylic craft paint from the dollar store (paint added 14 gr/0.5 oz just for interest sake); and
• control surface hinges all made with Foam Tac, elevon control surfaces also reinforced with transparent duct tape.

I also reduced the weight by cutting out some more foam in the internal structure which also allows for better airflow through the electronics bay.

I built light, but kept it strong where it needs it to handle the abuse I plan on giving it and the abuse it will get from the NTM Prop Drive motor...:)
Hoping the third one will be the lucky one and I won't crash it or have components fail on me...fingers crossed.


Cheers,

Scott

RCP F18 V3 AND POWER UP ZOOM 450 MOTOR

Just back from the field after burning through a bunch of lipos testing another motor setup in my F18 V3.

This time I tested the Power Up 450 Zoom motor from Heads Up RChttp://www.headsuphobby.com/Power-Up-450-Zoom-Outrunner-Brushless-Motor-H-225.htm

I have used this motor before with great success on an FRC Foamies F35 600 that weighed about 20 oz with a 2200 Mah battery. I only ever used the 6x3 EMP prop on that motor as based on the chart on the Heads Up RC website, it was supposed to give the most thrust. So as part of this testing, I wanted to guage this motor's performance on other props, the 6x4 EMP and 6x4 APC.

These are the numbers I got from the wattmeter -

• 6x3 EMP - 23A/267 W
• 6x4 EMP - 27A/315 W
• 6x4 APC - 28.5A/333 W

My AUW on this plane with this motor and a 2200 battery (I had to use a 2200 to get my CofG right due to the fact this motor weighs about 20 grams more than the previous heaviest motor I had tested) is 599 grams/21.2 oz. This is a weight gain of about 42.5 grams/1.5 oz over the previous heaviest weight, so my wing loading was a bit higher at 6.4 oz/sq ft.

It was a bit windier today than when I did the previous tests, but at this weight it handled the wind without problem.

I have yet to watch the video, but at first impression, I think the 6x4 APC is definitely the quickest of the three props, better vertical as well, took much longer for the speed to fall off than with the two EMP props.

All three props allowed me to easily cruise around at about 50% throttle at this weight and fly slow and under control down to about 35-40% throttle. I had good power and punch out with all three props, enough to get me out of trouble if I got too slow or to safely power out of high alpha.

Of all the motors tested thus far, this one gave me what I perceive as the best overall speed on all three props. I didn't see too much of a difference between the 6x3 and 6x4 EMP props in performance, other than I would probably get a bit more endurance out of a battery on the 6x3 EMP prop.

I would estimate with the way I like to fly that I would easily get 6:30 minute flights with the 6x3 EMP, about 6:00 flights on the 6x4 EMP and about 5:30 on the 6x4 APC using a 2200 battery.

I used a Turnigy Plush 40A ESC with the timing set to medium, it did not warm up at all on the EMP props and got just a tiny bit warm on the APC prop, the motor got slightly warm on the EMP props and a bit warmer with the APC prop, but nothing to be worried about, I could easily keep my finger on the motor for 5 seconds after the flights.

The good news is that this weight and power setup are still in the "sweet spot" for this plane, there was no impact on handling or aerobatics at this heavier weight, no wing flex and I didn't really feel much impact with the increased wing loading other than it was a little more "skittish" at slow speeds, I had to keep a closer eye on it's speed so I didn't stall out, but that could have also been because of the 8-10 kt winds that were blowing.

So this is still a very good weight and setup for this plane, a bit more speed than the other motors tested and the extra 42.5 grams/1.5 oz definitely helped in the wind, so if you fly in windy conditions like I often do, this might be a better weight for you than some of the super light setups I was testing in calm wind conditions.

I plan on testing one more motor setup in this plane, the Super Mega Jet V2 (SMJV2).  I have used that motor many times before, but never tested it with EMP props, so I am going to give that a try and then I think that will be the last setup I will test, if I go up to the NTM Prop Drive I will probably be over 23 grams which is apparently where the performance starts to really fall off on this plane.

Weather is not supposed to be great for the next several days, so I hope to also get my F22 V3 finished off.

Cheers,

Scott

RC POWERS F18 V3 AND TURNIGY D2826/6 2200 KV MOTOR

Just finished up another round of testing on my F18 with yet another motor and combination of props.

This time I tested a motor which I have already used on several planes, the Turnigy D2826/6 2200 Kv motor from Hobby King http://hobbyking.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=12919

Although I have used this motor before, during this period of testing I tried a couple different things

• I had read some research that Grey from the RC Powers forums did on the RC Timer 2826/6 motor and he mentioned it seemed to like medium timing on the ESC better than the default timing of low. I never paid much attention to this before when I used this motor, I think I have used high and low, but never medium;
• I had only ever used a 6x4 APC prop on this motor, so I wanted to see what if any difference in performance I would get out of trying the 6x3 and 6x4 EMP props.

Since Hobby King recommends a 40A ESC for this motor, I used a Turnigy Plush 40A ESC. Because of the bigger ESC and the fact that this motor is a few grams heavier than the FP 2700 Kv motor and the RCT 2212/6 motor, my AUW with the 1600 battery went up about 9 gr from yesterday's testing, so my weight today was 529 gr/18.66 oz.

The numbers off the wattmeter for each of the props -

• 6x4 APC - 24A/274W
• 6x3 EMP - 23A/275W
• 6x4 EMP - 26A/301W

The plane flew great in all configurations, I will wait until I watch the video before determining which one I feel was the fastest and/or my favorite, it was hard to tell. The performance difference between the 6x4 APC and 6x3 EMP was negligible, a tiny advantage in initial acceleration possibly to the 6x3, but other than that almost identical. The 6x4 EMP felt a little bit "snappier", I know that is not exactly an exact term when trying to evaluate something, but it just felt that way when flying it.

Again, I don't think the D2826/6 as fast as the FP 2700 Kv motor, very similar to the RCTimer motor in a lot of ways, but I do feel that the 2826/6 performed better (slightly more power and speed) with the 6x4 APC prop than did the RCT 2212/6. The 2826/6 ran pretty cool in all configurations, cooler than the RC Timer motor, but I think I may need to reevaluate a different 2212 motor as I think there might be a bearing not working right in the one I tested.

The plane cruised easily at 50% throttle on all three props, the slight increase in weight had no impact on the aerobatic performance of the plane. 

Seeing the amp readings I got, I may try this setup again with a 30A ESC for a bit of a weight saving as long as it doesn't push the 30A ESC too hard.

This is another great option as a motor for this plane at this weight, the more I fly it at this weight, I think this is right around the "sweet spot" from a standpoint of handling for this plane, it turns on a dime, has no bad habits that I have been able to find, I can push this plane very hard and it responds with ease.

Endurance wise with this motor I would say about 5:30 minute flight times is a good number for all three props on a 1600 battery for my flying style which does involve lots of bursts of wide open throttle.

I have another video uploading now which should be posted later today. I will be taking a break for a few days as I will be away with family commitments, but have at least one other motor, the Power Up Zoom 450 that I want to test.

I have been learning a lot about different motors I have never tried before and different options for props and how they compare from a standpoint of performance, endurance, amp draw, etc, so I hope that some of this has been useful to others as well. Certainly has been a great excuse to get out and fly this beautiful plane more often, it will be tough to fly something else after getting so comfortable with the F18!

Update - here is video I shot of today's testing

Cheers,

Scott

F18 WITH RC TIMER 2212-6 2200 Kv MOTOR

Hi everyone -

Just finished up another round of testing with my F18 with another motor and different prop combos. Today I was testing the RC Timer 2212-6 2200 Kv motor http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=116&productname=

I was running a Turnigy Plush 30A ESC and 1600 Mah 3S 30-40C discharge batteries. I had never used this motor before today, but did some reading on a great thread that Grey from the RC Powers Forums started comparing the 2212-6 and 2826/6 motors, so I had a bit of an idea of what to expect. Grey's thread is herehttp://www.rcpowers.com/community/threads/2212-6-vs-2826-6-motors.9860/ 

I read a review on the RC timer website of a person bench testing the motor on 6x4 APC and 6x3 EMP props and they got more thrust on the EMP, so I decided to test three different props today to see what they would give me.

Here are the wattmeter numbers I got with each of the three props using a freshly charged battery each time -

• 6x4 APC - 23A/260W
• 6x3 EMP - 21A/278W
• 6x4 EMP - 25A/300W

My AUW with the 1600 Mah battery was 520gr/18.34 oz, a negligible difference from the weight testing the Focal Price 2700 Kv, so I won't bore you with the wing loading numbers, etc.

With the 6x4 APC and 6x3 EMP props, top speed and power seemed to be pretty much equal, at least that is how it looked to my eyes and by the feel of the plane. The 6x3 EMP spooled up a bit faster, so slightly better punch and acceleration, but only just for that first little jump, then it was pretty much equal to the 6x4 APC.

From a standpoint of efficiency, I personally think I would get longer flights with the 6x3 EMP prop, easily in the neighborhood of 6:15 minute flights, with the APC more like 5:45. I was able to fly slowly and do very decent high alpha with both props, cruising was around 50% and they both provided enough thrust to allow me to fly slowly under control with about 40% throttle. Vertical performance was about the same as was aerobatics with the power provided by both props. So the slight edge in efficiency and endurance in my tests would go to the 6x3 EMP prop.

The 6x4 EMP prop definitely had a little more snap and speed than the APC and the 6x3 EMP, but also pushed the system harder, the motor and ESC were definitely warmer with the 6x4 EMP, but due to the fact I was getting more speed and punch, I was probably pushing it a bit harder as well. 

My initial thoughts at the field were that I preferred the 6x4 EMP prop setup over the other two props.  But the more I watched the video above and thought about it, I think that the 6x3 EMP prop setup is best for all round speed, power and acceleration and the fact that it runs cooler and more efficiently than the 6x4 EMP.

So where does this motor fit in with the other two I have already tested, the MJV3 and the Focal Price 2700? I would say somewhere in the middle with respect to speed and power, definitely gave me more of a cushion of power than the MJV3 and since I didn't have to run around at 60% throttle like I did with the MJV3, the endurance with the 6x3 EMP prop was about the same.

It is not as fast as the FP 2700 for sure, but it can also easily run a wider range of props on a 3S than the FP motor, so that could be an advantage depending on what type of performance you like or what props you have available to you. It ran more efficiently than the FP 2700 motor with all three props, so a bit of an advantage there. 

With my plane at this weight I prefer this motor over the MJV3, I just like having that extra little cushion of speed and power. I think I still like the FP 2700 motor the best of the three, but I do give this RC Timer motor a strong recommendation as a very versatile (because of it's ability to handle these three different 6" props) and efficient motor and for the price $9.87 and the cheap, expeditious shipping that RC Timer offers, it is a great motor for parkjets in this weight range.One thing I did note on this motor, maybe it is just this one I was using, but it was a bit noisy compared to other motors, I'm not sure if I have a bad bearing, but sometimes on the slow passes, I could hear something going on with the motor that I don't normally experience with others, but for the price, tough to go wrong!
I am hoping to get one more motor tested tomorrow, the popular Turnigy D2826/6 2200 Kv motorhttp://hobbyking.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=12919 which I use with great success on my Mig 29 V1 and other parkjets in this weight range of 18-20 oz.

 I have never tested it on any EMP props, so I think I will give those a go and see what happens. I plan on swapping out my ESC for a 40A ESC as that is what I normally run this motor on as it is rated at 34A and I have great success with that size ESC. I will based on what I learned from Grey's testing change my ESC timing to medium for the test, I think I had been previously running these motors no low setting, so perhaps I wasn't getting max power and efficiency out of it.
Then I am sure you will be happy to hear that I will be taking a few days break for some family commitments... :)

Actually after the D2826/6 motor, I really only want to try out the Zoom 450 after that, maybe the SMJV2, but definitely the Zoom 450.

I took a little break to install the D2826/6 motor in the plane now and put the 40A ESC in the plane as well with the timing set at "middle" (medium).  Interesting to note, I shortened up the battery connector wires from the ESC, I had them pretty long for a previous project, I also cut off the ferrite ring from the receiver lead of the ESC and saved myself 11gr/0.4 oz!  Wouldn't think it would make that much difference, but I'm glad I did now!

My AUW with the new motor and ESC is now 529gr/18.66 oz, so still very good, that will give me a wing loading of 5.65 oz/sq ft.  

Cheers,

Scott

TESTING THE FOCAL PRICE 2700 KV MOTOR

Hi everyone -

Just got back from the field doing some great testing on a new motor (new for me anyway) on my F18. I was testing the Focal Price 2700 Kv motor that Jay (Boxermad84) has been using for a while and that Greg (F1wanabe) used with great success on his Mig29 V3 on both 2 and 3S setups.

Here is the link to the motor

http://www.focalprice.com/YO090X/A2212_2700KV_Outrunner_Brushless_Motor_for_Airplane.html

The stats on this motor are that it's max current is 25A, so I left the Turnigy Plush 30A ESC in the plane that I had been using with the MJV3.

The numbers from the wattmeter -
6x3 prop - 28A/304W
6x4 prop - 38A/444W (don't get too excited just yet, more on this later...)

Based on advice from Greg and Jay, I only used EMP props on this motor, I wanted to compare the 6x3 and 6x4 EMP props for performance to see if there was a difference.

So the new numbers for this plane with this new motor are AUW with the 1600 Mah battery, 517 gr/18.24 oz, wing loading 5.5 oz/sq ft, using the number 30 for oz of thrust that Greg mentioned in his Mig 29V3 video for a 3s, my thrust to weight is 1.6:1 (me likey a lot!)

I did shoot some video of the plane on 6x3 and 6x4, it is processing now so should be ready to upload later today.

All I can say is WOW! What a great setup for this plane at this weight, significant increase in speed, punch out power and vertical for only 12 grams gain in weight! Fortunately it was very calm, so I was able to do some high alpha, it flew high alpha like a dream (well, maybe a nightmare, my high alpha skills need a lot of work...)

On the 6x3 prop I was getting good solid 5 minute flights on a 1600 battery, 7:30 on a 2200 (with very little impact on performance with the extra weight), so I am excited to get my 1800 batteries as I think from watching Jay's videos that will be the ideal battery for this motor to get good solid flights and the extra weight will help in the windier conditions. I was able to cruise around comfortably at 50% throttle. When I landed, the motor was a bit warm to the touch, as was the ESC, but nothing abnormal and the battery was cool (my 1600s are 30-40C discharge).

So on the second test, I swapped out for the 6x4 prop. I would have to say noticeably a bit more speed and punch with the 6x4, and still cruising comfortably at half throttle, excellent aerobatics. However, upon landing, the motor was very warm, too warm for my liking as was the ESC. The Turnigy Plush ESC is rated to handle bursts of 40A, so when I saw 38A on the wattmeter, I went ahead anyway, but I was probably pushing the ESC and motor harder than they need to be, and extended use of the 6x4 with my flying style would probably end up in premature burnout of the motor, ESC and/or both.

So, the big winning combination is definitely the 6x3 EMP prop, I loved how this plane handled with this setup! Not that I didn't like it with the MJV3, but my confidence was so much higher knowing I had that extra power at my fingertips for such a small gain in weight, but exceptional gain in performance!

I know Jay and Greg have said this in the past and I second...well I guess third ...their strong recommendation not to use a 6x4 APC on this motor, my feeling after seeing what it did with the 6x4 EMP, the extra agressive bite of the APC prop would burn this motor out pretty quick.

I don't know why I waited so long to try this motor out, but I am very glad I did and given it is $11.89 USD and Focal Price offers worldwide free shipping, I can use a 30A ESC and get that kind of performance, it is a big winner in my books, especially with that much extra power for only a 12 gram/0.42oz gain in weight!

I plan on testing more motors and setups on this plane over the days and weeks to come, but this Focal Price 2700 Kv motor on a 6x3 EMP prop has set the bar pretty high in my humble opinion.

Just for info, the best price I have been able to find on EMP props is from RC Timer, you can get them in bulk packs of 5 for $4.49 http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=218&productname=, but I strongly encourage you to balance them. I will be writing up another report on this thread about the importance of making sure the prop you put on is balanced story http://www.rcpowers.com/community/threads/balancing-a-prop-video.13088/page-2#post-191861

I just installed the RC Timer BC 2212/6 motor in the F18 which I hope to test tomorrow
http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=116&productname=  Some feedback I read on the RC Timer website was that one person got more thrust from a 6x3 EMP prop, 32 oz in fact and 28 oz on a 6x4 APC, so I hope to test the 6x4 APC, and the 6x3 and 6x4 EMPs.  I will still run the Turnigy Plush 30A ESC and 1600 battery for the test to see what I get.  Never used this motor before, so I am excited to see what it can do.

With the new motor, my AUW with a 1600 Mah battery is 518 gr/18.27 oz, so basically the same as with the Focal Price 2700 Kv.

Update on the F22 V3 build, wing plate and fuselage are together, belly plate and bottom fuse on, just waiting for the glue to all dry up, will probably start installing electronics and gluing on the Kf airfoils next.  Will be using 2 RC Timer 9gr metal gear servos for the elevons and 4 plastic gear servos for the ailerons and rudders to save some weight.

Cheers,

Scott

2200 Mah BATTERY AND MJV3 COMBO

It was a bit windy at the field again today, 10 mph winds, I have been getting bounced around pretty good with my lightweight F18 using a 1600 Mah battery and the MJV3 which is an excellent combo.  The plane is a real handful in the wind at that weight 505 gr/17.8 oz, so I wanted to see how it handled the extra weight of the 2200 battery.

It flew great, stability and tracking in the wind were greatly improved, my new weight with the 2200 is 555 gr/19.6 oz.  It did come with some costs, I had to fly at about 10% higher throttle setting so 65-70% throttle for just cruising around.  This gave me about a 7-7:30 minute flight time fighting the wind and carrying the weight.  Top end speed was also reduced as was vertical performance.  Even with good momentum, I could go about 25 ft straight up in the vertical before it would fall off and stall.

Aerobatics and flying performance were not really affected, still turned on a dime, looped and rolled really well, wasn't sluggish at all except at higher ends of the throttle.  As the battery would start to get "tired" about midway through the flight, the difference between 70% and full throttle was negligible.

The motor also came down quite a bit warmer from running it for a longer period of time at a higher throttle setting, after a couple flights I let it cool down completely as I could feel it starting to lose power after running it hot for an extended period of time.

I had to add some tape to my elevon hinges as the Foam Tac started to give away.

Just weighed the Focal Price motor with prop, weighs 65 gr/2.3 oz.

Hope to get some more testing done with the F18 today.

Cheers,

Scott